Elon Musk & Jensen Huang

Alswaha: Please have a seat. Now I'm sure we can do a bigger round of applause for one of the greatest two leaders of our history. Let's go ahead. So we're talking about, I lost count, you know, $7 to $8 trillion worth of market cap, comp, I lost count.

But right now, we're here to celebrate a historic moment, a moment that yesterday, during the dinner, and thank you for joining us under the patronage of the honorable president and His Royal Highness, the Crown Prince, Musaed, where we had the pleasure to hear firsthand.

This is the greatest alliance between the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia and the United States, where we have joined hands and you have helped us build our energy-based economy, fueling and energizing the industrial age, and now fast-forward, going to the intelligence age, where we can fuel AI, factories, robotics, AVs, and all of the rest. Speaking of that, let's start with you Elon, if you don't mind. Jensen, feel free to chime in.

You have a big fascination of something all of us have admired, first-order thinking, which Jensen sometimes calls first-order scaling, which is an opportunity for how you have dropped the cost of batteries from 1,000 for kilowatt hour to sub 100 bucks. And right now you're doing the same thing with robotics for actuators, with servo rotors and motors.

So I wanna hear from you how do you manage to always disrupt every single industry with that thinking? Well, Elon Musk: it's mostly not, disruption, it's, creation. So with, say, SpaceX, with, reusable rockets, there really weren't any reusable rockets.

But the essence of getting. Of revolutionizing space travel is reusability. If you throw the rocket away every time, the cost of access to space is extremely high.

With respect to electric cars, there weren't any electric cars when we started making them, really. They you couldn't buy any, to the best of my knowledge. So with Tesla, we wanted to make electric cars compelling, and affordable.

That was the goal. The, you know, with respect to humanoid robotics, there are no useful humanoid robotic robots at this point. There are sort of gimmicks, but there are no, there are no actually useful humanoid robots.

And I think Tesla's gonna make the first actually useful humanoid robots. And this will be quite a revolution, and I think something that will, that everyone will want. Because I always think of like who wouldn't want their own personal C-3PO R2-D2?

Oh, yeah. Of course. Everyone would want one, right? And then there would be many in industry, providing products and services.

This is why I say that humanoid robots will be the biggest industry or the biggest product ever, bigger than cell phones or anything else because everyone's gonna want one and or maybe more than, more than one, and there'll be many in industry. I Jensen Huang: just want R2-D2 in C-3PO's body. Yeah. Alswaha: There you go.

Well, Elon Musk: to, I mean, a humanoid robot would be better than R2-D2 and C-3PO Yeah. Times ten. Yeah. So the, it, and you know, people often talk about, sort of eliminating poverty and that kind of thing, but really the, this, how long have they been talking about that?

There's lots of talk, you know, there's lots of NGOs sort of trying to do these things, but really not succeeding. And and you know, the evidence speaks for itself. But but AI and humanoid robots will actually eliminate poverty.

And Tesla won't be the only one that makes them. I think Tesla will pioneer this, but there will be many other companies that make humanoid robots. But there is only basically one way to, make everyone wealthy, and that is AI and robotics.

Alswaha: And we can't talk about robotics without AI factories, and yesterday was such a historic day for the two nations, but also for all of us, where we celebrate the AI strategic partnership with the US, signed, witnessed by the honorable president and His Royal Highness, about how we are committing our capital energy land to energize the AI-US ecosystem to be able to build inference node, training nodes, and to be the most AI-enabled nation.

With that announcement, tell me what's, what's next in AI factories, Jensen? There's a, there's Jensen Huang: a beautiful story about how Saudi Arabia's building AI refineries and how building AI or oil refineries to AI factories. Alswaha: I love that. I you know, Jensen Huang: I've said that AI is an infrastructure, and the reason for that, of course, we understand AI from the perspective of the technology and how it's revolutionizing every industry.

Digital intelligence, of course, has applications into every field. And so it's gonna be used by every company, every industry, every country. In that way, it's foundational, and therefore it's part of infrastructure.

What is new about AI from a computer science perspective is that the way computing was done in the past was largely retrieval-based computing. Mm-hmm. Somebody typed in a story or somebody created a piece of art or came up with four versions of a digital ad or it's all pre-built by somebody, which is then using a system to retrieve the appropriate version for you. It's a retrieval-based computing model.

Hadoop and many of the frameworks and operating systems of the past all designed to retrieve the appropriate information for you. But today, software is going to be generated in real time. It's generative. Based on the context, based on the circumstance, based on who you are, based on the problem you asked it, based on your prompt, it will generate unique content for you.

Every single time for everybody, it's unique. When you use Groq, every time you use it is different. We all love Groq.

It's based on the, right, based on, based on the, based on the prompt that you give it and based on the circumstance. And so therefore, it used to be retrieval-based. Today, it's generative. And if it's generative, then, and every time is different, then you need AI factories all over the world to generate the content in real time, which is the reason why you need AI factories.

And this is a unique way of doing computation, but the benefit of course is that everything isn't preconceived and pre-documented- Yeah. And it's, it's, contextually contextually sensible and and therefore intelligent. So Alswaha: AI factories and robotics, and we heard it yesterday from His Royal Highness, his vision, how to augment our workforce with roughly tens of millions of robotics to be able to infuse the next wave of productivity and progress.

But this scares a lot of folks here when it comes to the future of jobs. So let's hear about your thoughts, Elon and Jensen, on that. Sure. Well, Elon Musk: if you say like in the long term, where will things end up?

Long term, I don't know what long term is. Maybe it's 10, 20 years or something like that. For me, that's long term.

My prediction is that work will be optional. Optional? Optional. Alswaha: We'll take that. Yeah. I mean, Elon Musk: it'll be like, playing sports or a video game or something like that.

If you want to work, you know, in the same way like you can, you can go to the store and just buy some vegetables, or you could grow vegetables in your backyard. It's much harder to grow vegetables in your backyard, but some people still do it because they like growing vegetables. That will be what work is like, optional.

And between now and then, there's actually a lot of work to get to that point. Mm-hmm. And I always recommend people read Iain Bank's, Culture books to get a sense for what a probable positive AI future is like. And interestingly, in those books, money is no longer doesn't exist.

It's kind of interesting. And I my guess is in if you go out long enough, assuming there's a continued improvement in AI and robotics, which there's seems likely, the money will stop being relevant at some point in the future. The now, there will still be constraints on power, like in a, like electricity and mass.

The fundamental physics elements will still be, like, still be constraints. But I think at some point, currency becomes irrelevant. Jensen, Alswaha: any thoughts? By Elon Musk: the way, the Nvidia earnings call is later today.

Jensen Huang: And by the way, since currency's irrelevant. Cheers. Elon just wants to, share with you some breaking news. The two of us who like to share some breaking news.

Listen, I would say, I would say there's, different horizons you could look at. Everybody's jobs will be different. That, I think that's for sure.

How the students learn will be different. How people do their work will be different, obviously, because a lot of the things that we do mundanely or arduously or very difficultly are going to be done very simply. And so we're gonna be more productive from that sense.

One of the things that I will say is that for most people or a company, if some if your life becomes more productive and if the things that you're doing, with great difficulty become simpler, it is very likely, because you have so many ideas, you'll have more time to go pursue things. It is my guess that Elon will be busier as a result of AI. I'm gonna be busier as a result of AI.

And the reason for that is because we have so many ideas we wanna pursue, so many things that that we still have in our backlog inside our company that we can go pursue. If we're more productive, we can get to those things faster. And so in the near term, I would say that there's every evidence that we will be more productive and yet still be busier because we have so many ideas.

One thing that I will say, give you some evidence is that, and I was just telling Elon about this earlier, radiology, for example, has largely been, converted to AI-driven radiology, and there's some really great companies doing that. And the surprising thing is the prediction that all radiologists would be the first jobs to go was exactly the opposite.

The trend shows that there are more radiologists being hired now as a result of AI. And the reason for that, if you take a step back, it's because the goal of a radiologist is not to study the images. The goal of a radiologist is to diagnose a disease.

Now, the studying of the images became so productive, they could study more images, study more modalities, spend more time with the patients, and as a result, they're actually accepting more patients. We're doing more radiology all around the world. We're doing a better job of diagnosing disease.

And so that's, that's kind of the near term, near term, outcome of, AI and productivity. And we'll see, we'll see what happens long term. You know, I when currency doesn't matter anymore, just, you know, let me know right before.

You'll Elon Musk: see it coming. Jensen Huang: You'll see it coming. Like, Elon Musk: We text often, so Yeah, we do.

Yeah, just text it out. Just let me know before. Don'I kinda, Alswaha: I kinda agree with both of you because if you look at every technological trend, every general purpose technology has been net new positive for the globe, for humanity and so forth.

And let me share with you two case studies. And I and and Your Jensen Huang: Excellency, I think it's precisely the reason, the reason for that is because all the great ideas from innovators like Elon, you have so many good Indeed. That And Alswaha: Jensen as well.

Jensen Huang: Yeah, well, you Indeed. Thank you. So Alswaha: let me share with you two stories from two Saudi innovators in collaboration with a lot of the great work that NVIDIA does, that Groq does.

So one of them is Professor Omar Yaghi, who's the first American Saudi to win a Nobel Prize in creating new chemistry, and the way he has done that, he has leveraged your AI accelerators and models like Groq to be able to create new chemistry when it comes to metal organic frameworks.

Those are metal ions that are positively charged with organic linkers to be able to effectively create a sponge with.33 nanometers pores to capture water from air and also to capture carbon dioxide.

The second story has also to do with AI accelerated by NVIDIA and with models like Groq, which is NanoPalm, which is effectively creating a nanorobot 500 nanometers by 1000 nanometers to be able to do gene editing, leveraging the CRISPR technology to take out sickle cell disease.

Now, in both these instances, they originated 20 years ago in research, but AI was able to really accelerate the outcomes and the outputs such that we can move into new value pools. So I think with every technological trend, humanity's gonna always manage to shift to new value pools when it comes to workforce and productivity. But we have some great announcements to talk about here today.

Let's begin with you Elon, the things that we're doing with xAI. Yeah, we're Elon Musk: excited to announce that, we're doing a, a 500, megawatt, I mean, yeah, 500. Sorry. 500 megawatt. 500 megawatt, yeah.

We're Alswaha: doing 500- We're doing 500 megawatts. Elon Musk: Gigawatt? Sorry, there'At point, yeah. Yeah. No, the 500 gigawatt one will have to wait.

So, I that'll be eight bazillion trillion dollars. Stop that.

So, yeah, we we're, we're doing a, xAI and the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia are doing Humane, 500 megawatts- Alswaha: Yeah. Starting with 50 megawatts- Yeah. Phase one, and we're doing it with NVIDIA.

Yeah. Congratulations to the Humane team, to Target team. Such a fantastic job. Jensen, I think we're also doing some great announcements, this week.

We are? Yeah. We're, we're announcing, we're Jensen Huang: announcing all kinds of things. Our partnership with Humane is going incredibly well. First of all, we worked together to get this company started and off the ground and just got an incredible customer with Elon.

Could you imagine a startup company, approximately zero billion dollars in revenues now going to, build a data center for Elon? 500 megawatts is gigantic. This company is off the charts, right away.

In addition to that, we're, working, AWS, as you know, is also Congratulations Yeah. Alswaha: The Humane team with, AWS, starting with 100 megawatts with a gigawatt ambition and counting. So Jensen Huang: AWS is also coming to Humane.

We're working with, Humane on Omniverse, digital twins. As you know, that AI is not just, well, just agentic AI and chatbots and cognitive AI is incredibly important to the world. But AI applies to everything, chemicals and proteins and genes and physics and fluid dynamics and particles, and of course, robotics and activation.

And we created this world called Omniverse where robots can learn how to be good robots and it's physically based. It obeys the laws of physics, and so robots can learn in these environments, and we're working with Humane to apply Omniverse to all kinds of, digital factories and robotics and warehouses and things like that. And so that's, that's another.

We're, we're also working, in Saudi Arabia to build supercomputers to simulate quantum computers Indeed. And using our computers to be the controller and the error correction. Quantum error correction, requires an enormous amount of computation, and so we're doing a lot of great work there too.

So a big partnership with Humane. They're off the charts, off the ground and off the charts at the same time. This Alswaha: is how we walk the talk in the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia in partnership with the US.

Yesterday, the president and His Royal Highness announced the AI strategic framework and partnership. Today, we're going big with Elon and Jensen, so thank you for those opportunities. Now, they told me I have time for two last questions, so last night at the dinner, I got a number of questions because it seems that the schedule leaked and everybody was giving me hints about the last two questions I'm gonna do.

So the first one was for you Elon, and there's a big one for you Jensen, so prepare for that one AI in space, is that possible? Yes. If civilization continues, which it probably will, then AI in space is inevitable. You know, I always have to, like, preface that, you know?

We shouldn't take civilization for granted. Yeah. We need to make sure to take care to ensure that civilization has an upward arc. I mean, any student of history knows that civilization does not always have an upward arc, and in fact, civilizations have life cycles.

So hopefully we are in a strong upward arc. I think we are for now, but we don't wanna take that for granted or be complacent. But the.

In order to. The way to think of AI in space is that in order to achieve any meaningful percentage of a Kardashev II scale civilization where you're using even a millionth of, a millionth, of the sun's energy, you must have solar powered AI satellites in deep space. So the. Once you realize, like.

Once you think in terms of a Kardashev II scale civilization, which is what percentage of the sun's energy are you turning into useful work, then you're. Then it becomes obvious that space is overwhelmingly what matters. Overwhelmingly. The sun only receives one, roughly one two-billionth of.

The Earth only receives roughly, one two-billionth of the sun's energy. So if you want to have something that is, say, a million times more energy than Earth could possibly Wow. You must go into space.

It's. And so, you know, this is where it's kinda handy to have a space company, I guess. Sell the book, as they say. Easier Jensen Huang: to cool chips in space too.

Yes. Easier to cool chips in space, yeah. Yes, Elon Musk: there's definitely no water in space, so you're gonna have to do something- Yeah. That doesn't involve water.

Just Jensen Huang: hang out. Well, it's, it's. You just gotta radiate. That's right. So my estimate is that actually the, that the cost of electricity, like the cost effectiveness of AI in space will be overwhelmingly better than AI on the ground.

So far, long before you exhaust potential energy sources on Earth, long before, meaning like I think even perhaps in the or five-year timeframe, the lowest cost way to do AI compute will be with solar powered AI satellites. So I'd say not more than five years from now. Wow. Wow. And just look at the supercomputers we're building together.

Let's say each one of the racks is two tons. Out of that two tons, 1.95 of it is probably for cooling. Right. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Imagine how tiny that little supercomputer is, right? Each one of these GB300 And will just be a little tiny thing.

And just electricity generation is already becoming a Elon Musk: challenge. So if you start doing any kind of scaling for both electricity generation and cooling, you realize, okay, space is incredibly compelling. So like let's say you wanted to do, I don't know, two or 300 gigawatts per year, of, AI compute.

Yeah. It's very difficult to do that on Earth. The. So the, US average electricity usage, last time I checked was around 460 gigawatts per year average usage. So something like say, you know, at three, 300.

If you're doing 300 gigawatts a year, that would be like two thirds of US electricity production per year. Yeah. There's no way you're building power plants at that level. And then if you take it up to, say, a terawatt per year, impossible.

Yeah. Like, you have to do that in space. There just is, there just is no way to do a terawatt, per year on Earth. And and in space, you've, you've got continuous solar.

You've got, You don't You actually don't need batteries 'cause it's always sunny in space. Jensen Huang: That's right. Exactly. And Elon Musk: and the solar panels actually become cheaper 'cause you don't need glass or framing.

And the cooling is just radiative. So that's, that's why I That's Jensen Huang: the dream. Yes. That's the dream.

Alswaha: So Jensen, everybody last night was asking me, and I'm mindful it's a earnings, call for you Mm. So I'm gonna say this delicately. Everybody has been asking me to ask you are we gonna have an AI bubble?

That's the last question? All right. Jensen Huang: Let's. No. All right, let me Well, let me just tell you what we see, okay?

So I think it's really important when you look at what's happening around the world and go back to first principles of what's happening in computer science and computing. There are three things that are, that's happening. The first thing is that we all know that Moore's Law has run its course, and the ability.

The amount of demand for computing versus the amount of computation we can get out of general purpose computing is really challenging. And so the world's been moving to accelerated computing for some time. We've been pushing this now for some, over 20 years.

Let me give you one statistic. I was just at Supercomputing. Six years ago, CPUs were 90% of the world's supercomputers, top 500 supercomputers.

Six years ago. This year, less than 15%. Went from 90% to 10%, and meanwhile, accelerated computing went from the other way, 10% to now 90%. Okay? So you're seeing that inflection point, the transition in high performance computing from general purpose computing to accelerated computing.

Well, one of the, one of the most data intensive, one of the most intensive computation things that the world does in cloud is data processing. Several hundred billion dollars of computation is done on just raw data processing. That wrecks Is the engine of the internet today.

That's going generative AI. It used to be running on CPUs, now it runs on GPUs. Which then says the third thing, when.

If you just look at those two applications, many of the internet companies can build enormous number of GPU supercomputers just doing that. Of course, then it creates this, the third opportunity on top of it, which is agentic AI. This is Grok and this is OpenAI, this is Anthropic, you know, this is Gemini.

Agentic AI sits on top of that. But don't, you know, don't forget to think about what is happening above, underneath what everybody sees as AI today. There's a whole movement of computing from general purpose computing to accelerated computing.

And that, if you just, if you take that into consideration, you'll come to the conclusion that in fact, what is left over to fuel that revolutionary agentic AI is not only substantially less than you thought, and all of it justified. Well, Alswaha: I was just informed by the team that my boss and your bosses is gonna talk next, the Honorable President and His Royal Highness, the Crown Prince, and hence we ran out of time.

But in essence This is our. Such, so much love for you Elon and Jensen. But this, in essence, is a '92 alliance that shifted from energy to digital to the intelligence age, powered by pioneers such as Elon and Jensen, to serve humanity and create, on a net new basis, new economies, new jobs, and a better future for humanity, powered by the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia and the United States.

Thank you for a lifetime partnership and friendship. Thank you Elon. Thank you Jensen. Thank you. Thank you.